Guest Post: Sean Meade Reviews The Illiad
My second big question is: what does ‘The Iliad’ mean? I’m very snobbish about exegesis, especially concerning the Bible (my training, as a former pastor), but including any suitably worthy literature (with concomitant training in British Lit and Analytic Philosophy). Exegesis, in principle, is simple: what was the author trying to communicate to the audience? (So why is good exegesis so hard to find? 😉 If we are to make any meaningful connection to the original work, this is where we have to begin. You can deploy your Reader Response Theory on ‘Twilight’ or some such drivel, but keep it off my Homer (I told you I’m a snob ;-).
We come to ‘The Iliad’ at a loss because Homer’s values are very different from ours. His presuppositions are vastly different from ours. I have touched on some of these already. The gods can show up at any time and throw any wrench in the works for almost any imaginable reason. We have to take the role of the gods seriously to take Homer seriously. What did their role say about the responsibility of people? Humans retain some responsibility, almost paradoxically. Helen isn’t completely off the hook for running away with Paris. Achilleus does not get a complete pass for his anger that causes the deaths of so many Achaean comrades. Agamemnon is not excused for his overbearing pride that contributed to the disagreement with Achilleus. And even noble Hektor faces bouts of inaction and cowardice for which he is not wholly exonerated.
Another value we find hard to understand is the ancient Greek concept of nobility. It’s just born there. If you’re a shepherd who’s not the natural-born son of King Priam and Queen Hekabe, that’s all you’ll ever be: a shepherd. The main characters are noble; many are first-generation half-deities and most (all?) have divinity in their bloodline somewhere. From our standpoint, Achilleus behaves like a monster, especially in his repeated attempted-desecration of Hektor’s body (the gods protect Hektor’s body and Achilleus’ ultimate honor by preserving Hektor’s corpse inviolate in almost the perfect proverbial deus ex machina). He’s sacrificed any claim to nobility as far as we’re concerned. Not so for Homer and the ancient Greeks; Achilleus retains his nobility, though it is clouded by sins. He receives partial pardons and rationalizations. From our perspective, we view him as maybe the original anti-hero. Homer’s view is much less ambivalent, and Achilleus gets away with things for which lesser men would go straight to Tartaros without passing ‘Go’. It’s a far cry from our 21st century Western concept of nobility and our love of ‘rags to riches’ fables. It’s only riches to riches here (though maybe no one knew through the rags that you were really rich).
So what is Homer’s message? The conclusion of my barely-better-than-cursory reading is: Given that nobility and greatness are natural, almost literally gifts of fate (the Fates); and that humans are subject to the whims of the gods; it is best to be brave and seek glory (within reason–with a glance forward to Aristotle’s middle-way ethic). How’s that going to help you with your job or family? Not much. It’s fodder for thinking about societal values and a long way from whether or not to stick it out in your mediocre, going-nowhere job. (It might possibly apply to whether or not you should run away with your neighbor’s spouse.)
For most of us, ‘The Iliad’ is probably a test in proper exegesis more than someplace we should or will go to look for meaning. But maybe that’s just my soap box 😉
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zen:
September 11th, 2010 at 6:42 am
Hi Sean,
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"Achilleus retains his nobility, though it is clouded by sins. He receives partial pardons and rationalizations. From our perspective, we view him as maybe the original anti-hero. Homer’s view is much less ambivalent, and Achilleus gets away with things for which lesser men would go straight to Tartaros without passing ‘Go’. It’s a far cry from our 21st century Western concept of nobility and our love of ‘rags to riches’ fables. It’s only riches to riches here (though maybe no one knew through the rags that you were really rich)."
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I thought that was very interesting.
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How does Achilles as a character then stack up against Milton’s Satan? (Or the Illiad vs. Paradise Lost, if you prefer).
Dave Schuler:
September 11th, 2010 at 11:26 pm
What is the theme of the Illiad?Achilles’ wrath, to Greece the direful spring
Of woes unnumber’d, heavenly goddess, sing!A hero’s single flaw brings sorrow to many. With great power comes great responsibility.
J. Scott:
September 12th, 2010 at 12:09 am
The timing of this review could not be more fortuitous; I’ve several Greek classics, including the Iliad in the queue. As Charles Hill said in his recent book, Grand Strategies, there is much to learn an era from good works of literature; and what I have learned is how little man has changed.
Sean:
September 12th, 2010 at 12:16 am
Thanks again, Mark.
Milton’s view is much closer to what we would think of as ‘nobility’. IIRC, Milton was a fairly traditional, orthodox Christian. Satan is a pure anti-hero. Interestingly, both protagonists are very compelling, probably what they have most in common.
What do you think?
DS: But he can’t escape his fate. I don’t think we should view it purely as a character flaw and its results. Doesn’t that make it too much of a morality play?
Jason:
September 12th, 2010 at 1:33 am
Nicely done! I’m sort of with you, I think. Taking useful morality lessons from the Iliad requires distortions that old-fashioned English majors like you and me can’t make without wincing 😉 But I’m still moved by Priam’s appeal to Achilles, which I once heard explained as "civilization’s last, desperate appeal to humanity’s savage core," or something of that sort. That’s taking it a bit far, but if Achilles had turned Priam away, I do think we’d read Hektor’s defeat differently, don’t you? If epithets weren’t always chosen merely for their syllabic values, then maybe it’s no accident that the last one in the work is "breaker of horses"–i.e. the one who brings order to wildness.(fwiw, the version I listened to was unabridged. Which made those catalogs looooooooong. On the same trip, we also listened to Heart of Darkness in one sitting–exactly as Marlow’s listeners would have.)
Sean:
September 12th, 2010 at 11:40 am
JS: glad it was timely.
thanks, Jason! leave it to you to be moved by the human element 🙂
interesting take on civilization’s appeal. let’s think of it as a happy synchronicity. i could have sworn you told me you listened to the abridged version. i don’t think i would have had the patience to listen!
Mercutio:
September 12th, 2010 at 1:40 pm
"So what is Homer’s message? The conclusion of my barely-better-than-cursory reading is: Given that nobility and greatness are natural, almost literally gifts of fate (the Fates); and that humans are subject to the whims of the gods; it is best to be brave and seek glory (within reason–with a glance forward to Aristotle’s middle-way ethic)."
This ignores completely the passage in the Odyssey in which Odysseus encounters Achilles in the Underworld. In response to Osysseus’ statement that he, Achilles, is the most famous of all Greeks, Achilles responds by stating that it is better to be a "pthete," ( a social position lower than that of a slave ) but alive than the greatest of all the dead.
Achilles is a man confronting is own mortality. This gives rise to stresses between life and death, social order ( represented by Agamemnon ) and individual striving ( which he represents ), fortune and misfortune ( represented by the aging Priam. ) Such are the generations of men, that they grow forth like leaves, spread, and then whiter.
As for the differences between Ancient Greek and modern morality, this includes the usual twaddle about how different and more enlightened. In point of fact the contemporary United States has very little actual social mobility and anyone who has seen a video game knows that blood and gore are a significant part of current culture. In this decade alone, the United States has killed hundreds of thousands of civilians.
Dave Schuler:
September 12th, 2010 at 4:50 pm
In this decade alone, the United States has killed hundreds of thousands of civilians. Document, please. If you’re referring to Iraq and the Lancet report, nearly all of the deaths reported there were Iraqi on Iraqi violence rather than U. S. on Iraqi.
J. Scott:
September 12th, 2010 at 5:11 pm
Reading the comments reminded me of one of Hill’s observations w/respect to Milton and The Iliad: "Epic poems often begin in medias res, in the middle of things, and Paradise Lost is no exception. The Iliad begins in the tenth year of the Trojan War. Accordingly we too may begin not with Milton’s book I but with book 5, because that is where the story really starts, with God." (page 98, Grand Strategies)
Mercutio:
September 12th, 2010 at 5:30 pm
If you’re referring to Iraq and the Lancet report, nearly all of the deaths reported there were Iraqi on Iraqi violence rather than U. S. on Iraqi.
Of course I am referring to Iraq. A "war of choice," for which the United States bears full responsibility.
That so many Americans woudl shirk responsibility for the consequences of their own actions does distinguish them from the heroic Homeric ethic even though their conduct is at least as bloodthirsty. It is no wonder that the rest of the world is now dismantling the esrtwhile American empire.
zen:
September 12th, 2010 at 5:41 pm
Ah, Mercutio, I’m not sure the world has much to teach America about acceptance of responsibility. Examples of mea culpa out there seem to be few and among great powers, still fewer.
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Sean, I think while anti-heroic, Satan was both far greater a persona than Achilles and also less free. Milton’s concepts of fate, choice and divinity differed considerably fromn Homer’s. I am due for a re-read of the Illiad though as it was 25 + years ago. Paradise Lost was only a little more recent 🙂
Larry Dunbar:
September 12th, 2010 at 6:32 pm
"Poetry is a dying art, and poetry appreciation is probably in an even worse state."
*
Poetry will never die out, because life moves as energy and poetry is the first-responder to energy as it "moves".
Mercutio:
September 12th, 2010 at 8:33 pm
Ah, Mercutio, I’m not sure the world has much to teach America about acceptance of responsibility. Examples of mea culpa out there seem to be few and among great powers, still fewer.
If by "the world" you mean the balance and harmony that underlies the universe, then the world has much to teach America about the meaning of the words moira and hybris.
As for the punishment of overweening power and its abuse, Homer’s discussion of Agamemnon says much.;
YT:
September 13th, 2010 at 1:22 am
Mercutio,
Re: hybris.
This lesson might be useful not only to America but to other powers blinded by their new found strengths.
P.S.: Enjoy your updates on news from the peripheries.
zen:
September 13th, 2010 at 2:03 am
"If by "the world" you mean the balance and harmony that underlies the universe…."
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Nothing so metaphysical, simply the society of states whose behavior is with regularity, unbalanced and disharmonious, not to mention special-pleading.:)